There has been a brisk debate about my post on What it means to forgive, and about Dave Warnock’s related post, including helpful responses by Chris Brauns whose post got both of us writing.
Thanks to PamBG for pointing me on her own blog to an article on forgiveness by Rev. Dr. Myron S. Augsburger. I agree with Pam that this article helps to clarify some of the issues we have been discussing. Here are some extracts, with my comments:
Forgiveness is not easy; it is hard … The cost of this resolution is to the innocent one, to the one doing the forgiving. In forgiving you resolve the problem within yourself, and you don’t even make the other feel it. That is never easy for us, nor is it easy for God.
So, forgiveness is mostly an issue for the one who forgives, and does not depend on any response from the one forgiven.
Peter writes that Christ bore our sins in his own body on the tree. (1 Pet 2:24) That is to say, Jesus literally absorbed into himself all of our sin, all of our hostility, all of our negativism toward God. … He literally experienced the intensity of our sin, and in doing so he could resolve his own wrath on sin and let us go free. There is justice in forgiveness because he did not dodge the issue. Nor can we, for we must actually enter into the problem; we must look sin squarely in the face and recognize it for what it is.
Note that Peter does not say that Christ bore the guilt of our sins. This is not the same thing, as Andrew has clarified.
When Paul says in Romans that God set forth Jesus as the expression of mercy (of propitiation, the mercy seat), on behalf of our sins, that he might be just in being the justifier of him that believeth in Jesus (3:23–26), he does not say that God justifies the one who apologizes for his mistakes. Rather, he justifies the one who believes in Jesus!
So justification does not depend on repentance in the sense of accepting forgiveness with an apology, but on faith.
I will leave it for you my readers to read the last part of the article, in which Augsburger puts forward his own model of the atonement. It is not precisely PSA. Nor is it incompatible with PSA. By recommending Augsburger’s model to you I am not rejecting PSA, but simply suggesting that in this particular context of forgiveness this model is a more helpful one.
Thanks, Pam, for the article. It was very worthwhile and helpful. It reminds me of Micah 6:8, “to act justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.”
Chris – you’re welcome for the link. I’m really pleased they chose to put that article on the web.
Peter – I’ve been having a long discussion on Ship of Fools with someone who sees himself as a whole-hearted supporter of PSA (but he’s fairly moderate, not ‘hard-core’, just wholehearted). He reckoned that the article was entirely supportive of PSA and he couldn’t figure why I was recommending it! Perceptions are interesting and I sometimes wonder if we are always talking about the same things when we have discussions.
Peter, thanks for these posts. I used to think that God’s forgiveness was only given to those that would repent. Its good to be challenged like this. I have to admit, I am still unclear on the role that the Cross plays in forgiveness. But I do see that more so than forgiveness, we need reconciliation with God, something only the Cross can achieve.
Interesting comment, Alastair. You’ve just challenged one of my assumptions because I’ve always assumed that forgiveness and reconciliation were intimately connected.
I think that there is something ‘mysteriously ontological’ about the cross, but I also see the cross as God’s demonstration of his forgiveness – because my sin put him there in the first place.
Pam, the questions in my head are things like:
– does God need the Cross in order to forgive sins ? Jesus forgave people their sins before his atoning death on the cross.
– do people need to come to faith in order to have God forgive them of sins ?
I would agree that reconciliation is not possible with forgiveness first.
Also sometimes I think that repentance is important to receive forgiveness, but in light of these posts I am now agreeing that God’s forgiveness seems to come when we have faith in Jesus, i.e. faith is the important thing, not repentance.
Its a good thing I don’t care much about systematic theology, otherwise I would be in a right state 🙂
The following may be helpful to this discussion. I posted it to Adrian’s blog over a day ago, but it has not yet appeared:
Adrian Warnock commented: ‘… some in the comments section seem to think that God counts us as righteous after we have repented, but this could not be further from the truth.’
To be made righteous, we need to be justified. To be justified, we need to be covered by the righteousness of Christ. If we stand in the righteousness of Christ, then we are saved, accepted, and forgiven. How do we come to be saved? We hear God’s call and respond with living active faith in Jesus Christ. What is the call? ‘Repent, and let everyone of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit’ (Acts 2:38, NKJ).
I assume that Adrian is not denying the importance of repentance with respect to salvation. True, repentance does not stand alone and of itself usher in salvation, but it is a vital fruit of faith in Jesus Christ. Through Him we are justified and forgiven. In Christ there is no condemnation (Rom. 8:1). Faith without repentance is dead: ‘For godly sorrow produces repentance to salvation’ (2 Cor.7:10, NKJ). Notice the order: godly sorrow, repentance, salvation. It is not simply a matter of belief, as James said: ’Even the demons believe’ (Jm.2:19, NKJ). Without repentance, we cannot be saved: ‘I tell you …unless you repent, you will all likewise perish’ (Luke13:3, NKJ).
Salvation is still an undeserved gift of grace, according to our faith – but faith that is genuine will also cause one to repent of sins. If it is devoid of repentance, then it is false. We cannot save ourselves, but we can act to ‘be saved’. It is like this:
Imagine that you have fallen into a turbulent sea and that you are struggling to swim—though you know that without rescue you are certain to drown. Mercifully, someone sees your situation and throws you a life belt attached to a lifeline and calls out for you to take hold. All you have to do is accept and be hauled to safety. Without the lifeline, you will drown. If you refuse to take hold of the lifeline, you will drown. You need that other person to save you, but you still have to act—you have to reach out and take hold.
So it is with the Gospel. We were without hope—but for the One God sent. He reaches out to us and wants to save, but we still have to act. We need to do something. We must believe and repent. This is biblical. Then God regenerates us through the gift of the Holy Spirit that we might know Him as Father and be accounted to receive eternal life.
Blessings!
Norman McIlwain
Thank you, Norman. I think I agree that repentance is a condition for salvation – although I am wary about specifying such conditions as I believe that God works in more varied ways than we understand. But that does not imply that repentance is a condition for forgiveness. God has forgiven our sins, whether or not we repent, that is, God has done all that is necessary on his part for us to be forgiven. It is our choice whether to accept this forgiveness or not.
‘God has forgiven our sins, whether or not we repent, that is, God has done all that is necessary on his part for us to be forgiven. It is our choice whether to accept this forgiveness or not.’
Thanks for your reply, Peter. I value your comments and I will try to find time to engage in this debate.
I would prefer to say: ‘God has done all on his part for us to be forgiven – for this to happen. It is our choice whether or not to seek the forgiveness He offers.
Regarding the first part of your statement, ‘God has forgiven our sins, whether or not we repent’, I would need to ask: ‘What particular sins are you talking about?’
True, from the cross, Jesus interceded on behalf of mankind and said, ‘Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do’ (Luke 23:34, NKJ); but please notice what the reason is for our Lord’s request. He interceded because of sins committed in ignorance: ‘they know not what they do’ – specifically, of course, with respect to the crucifixion. By extension, we are able to reason that His prayer includes all who are held to be guilty of unknowingly sinning against God – and it is this category and type of sins that are forgiven.
As Paul told Timothy, ‘I was formerly a blasphemer, a persecutor, and an insolent man; but I obtained mercy because I did it ignorantly in unbelief’ (1 Tim.1:13, NKJ). Peter also understood that the people had acted ‘in ignorance’ against Jesus, as had the rulers (Acts 3:17, NKJ). The remission of sins of ignorance was a reason for the atonement: ‘But into the second part the high priest went alone once a year, not without blood, which he offered for himself and for the people’s sins committed in ignorance’ (Heb.9:7, NKJ).
What other categories of sins can we recognize? There are, of course, the sins committed wilfully – in the full knowledge that the sins are against God’s law. These sins are distinguished because they are acts of deliberate will, knowingly committed against God. A third type must be the sins that are characterized by pulls of the flesh, where a person might be temporarily overtaken in a fault, although knowingly sinning. Does the Bible make such distinctions? It certainly does – in both Old and New Testaments.
Jesus did not forgive all the sins of mankind at the cross without qualification. He forgave sins of ignorance. We also should forgive those who unknowingly sin against us. What of those who deliberately sin, knowing that they are wrong – should we also forgive these? Yes, but as God forgives us. If we repent of our sinfulness and turn to God in faith, then He is gracious to forgive us all past sins and to cover us with His righteousness. Repentance is not required where the sins have been ignorantly committed.
For example: someone abuses and murders your daughter and afterwards shows no sorrow or remorse. Are you to forgive? – Absolutely not. Jesus did not forgive such sins at the cross. Such a person stands condemned to suffer the judgment of God, unless there is sincere and genuine repentance. Should we feel bitterness towards such sinners? – No. We should hate the acts of sin, not the person. Nevertheless, without repentance for sins that are knowingly committed, there remains the wrath and judgment of God.
Remember, Jesus said: ‘If your brother sins against you, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him. And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day returns to you, saying, ‘I repent,’ you shall forgive him’ (Luke 17:3-4, NKJ). Sins of which we are aware require repentance. It is just to forgive those who sin without knowing what they do. It is just to forgive those who repent. This is biblical.
Blessings.
Norman McIlwain